Transcript of Episode 20

Judy Bachar: This thing called California. That’s the name of the creation. And it’s like.

Judy Bachar: So, this is Bach. One hand accompany the other hand. For example, Chopin, this is the melody.

Judy Bachar: So, it goes and it goes, right? So, the right hand is the melody. While this… This is the accompany.

David Supple: Mm (affirmative).

Judy Bachar: And, for example, we are talking about how powerful is when you as a musician, especially as a singer, you learned one kind of an instrument. At least. So, the piano is the best because in the piano you have the melody and you have the harmony.

Judy Bachar: So, it’s like a whole orchestra.

David Supple: Mm-hmm (affirmative).

Judy Bachar: Like in a violin, you’d have only the melody. You cannot do harmony.

David Supple: Oh.

Judy Bachar: Okay. These gives you that you can do.

Judy Bachar: Now, if you’re a singer and you want to write your own songs, the best way is to have tool that you can actually create that. Now, it comes from you instead of people. So, it’s not like… You are not a via someone who created his own composition and then give it to you and then you give it to the people. I don’t think it’s bad at all, because if you are very, very professional as a singer, but you’re not that good as a pianist or as writing your own songs, it’s fine. If you take Whitney Huston, Barbara Streisand, all the big guys. If you take Frank Sinatra, he never ever wrote one song. He was actually singing Ira Gershwin, George Gershwin, all of the…

David Supple: Yep, yep.

Judy Bachar: Like Ella Fitzgerald as well.

David Supple: Yep.

Judy Bachar: But in the other hand you can take Elton John. When he sits on the piano, he and the piano and his song is one.

David Supple: Yeah.

Judy Bachar: This is Elton John. Stevie Wonder. Billy Joel.

David Supple: Yeah.

Judy Bachar: I mean you have big, big names.

David Supple: Is there a name for that?

Judy Bachar: For what?

David Supple: Where a musician…

David Supple: Write his own songs?

Judy Bachar: Yeah.

David Supple: I think it’s songstress or something. Or singer songwriter.

Judy Bachar: Singer songwriter, yeah. So, that’s what it’s called in the music industry?

David Supple: Exactly.

Judy Bachar: And in somehow it’s more. Because not only that you sing and your voice is like the instrument.

David Supple: Yeah.

Judy Bachar: That accomplished the song. It’s that you also created the music.

David Supple: Right. Yeah.

Judy Bachar: It’s like the genius, Mozart, not only that he knows how to play, but he wrote this music.

David Supple: Yeah, yeah.

Judy Bachar: So it’s a wow.

David Supple: Yeah, yeah.

Judy Bachar: And for example, one day I was sitting at the piano, I wanted to write a song for my husband. So, if I don’t know how to do it, then I’m dependent on others. And that can take a while to find the right composer through to find the right lyrics person, yah?

David Supple: Because you could think of the lyrics.

Judy Bachar: Exactly.

David Supple: You could even think of the lyrics, but then if you can’t put it with the music.

Judy Bachar: Exactly.

David Supple: You’re not going to get the song.

Judy Bachar: Exactly. So, first step is to learn an instrument. Mainly the piano it’s the best. Because it can gives you the whole scenario of the whole song.

David Supple: Mm-hmm (affirmative).

Judy Bachar: Then you can read poetry, you can read literature, to be more educated in how to write lyrics.

David Supple: Yeah.

Judy Bachar: And you just say what you want to say. You have to have an agenda. You have to have a message. What do I want to say to people? Right?

David Supple: Right,

Judy Bachar: Is it only love songs? Is it war songs? Is it like what? Peace songs?

David Supple: Yeah.

Judy Bachar: So I’d say this song is pretty simple but very powerful. It’s a song. So, I was sitting on the piano.

Judy Bachar: (singing).

Judy Bachar: So, this is, for example, when you want to say something and it’s come from your heart and there’s nobody else that can do it better than you.

David Supple: Yeah.

Judy Bachar: I mean, with the words with the music, if you want to do this. And then you feeling a little bit this. Or from this you want to do. So, you hear it, right?

David Supple: Yeah, yeah.

Judy Bachar: And you compose your own song.

David Supple: Mm-hmm (affirmative).

Judy Bachar: So, I think it’s a very powerful instrument.

David Supple: Yeah., yeah.

Judy Bachar: I think, if you want to be, it… I mean, you have example, very good examples in the world that people doesn’t know how to write their own songs. They’re doing great.

David Supple: Yeah.

Judy Bachar: Like, I just mentions some of the…

David Supple: Sinatra.

Judy Bachar: But I heard them, couple of them saying, “I wish I could write my own songs.”

David Supple: Mm-hmm (affirmative).

Judy Bachar: But they never thought about it because there was guided by someone, okay, this is the song, he is a great composer, and you just do it.

David Supple: Yeah.

Judy Bachar: So, they did it.

David Supple: Yeah.

Judy Bachar: What I do is I combine both.

David Supple: Mm-hmm (affirmative).

Judy Bachar: I do create my own music, but I do use other people music. I actually use an old kind of music in making my own. This is another way to look at it. I mean, you maybe didn’t write the music. But it’s like when you buy a house, maybe you didn’t build a house, but you make it your own.

David Supple: Right.

Judy Bachar: You…

David Supple: Remodeled it.

Judy Bachar: Remolded it, it looks definitely different from how it looked before.

David Supple: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. That’s a good analogy.

Judy Bachar: So, when you take a song, you can sing Somewhere Over The Rainbow. So, there’s Judy Garland.

David Supple: Mm-hmm (affirmative).

Judy Bachar: The one and only. So, she sing like 1 13 year old girl singing it in the movie.

Judy Bachar: (singing).

Judy Bachar: And I sing it…

Judy Bachar: (singing).

David Supple: Oh, yeah. You make it drone.

Judy Bachar: It’s like another thing.

David Supple: Yeah.

Judy Bachar: I like to take the gospel, I take everything I love, every genre of music, and I combine it in this one song, but I make it my own.

David Supple: Yeah, yeah.

Judy Bachar: Because I talk about somewhere there’s this rainbow and I wish I was there, this place with no war, with no crimes. With no insanity, where people are beautiful.

David Supple: Yeah, yeah.

Judy Bachar: They love, they life.

David Supple: Yeah. I think it’s an amazing analogy. Thank you so much.

Judy Bachar: You’re welcome.

David Supple: Yeah. Because it’s very similar to building. Because folks really care about… They don’t care about how it got there so much. They just care about the building. And so, it could have been separated, the design could have been separate from the execution. But they don’t really care. It’s just the product really.

Judy Bachar: Right.

David Supple: And I think it’s similar with music. Folks don’t really care how the hell they got to just hearing this amazing song. They just like hear the amazing song and they’re like, “Oh, I love that song.”

Judy Bachar: Right.

David Supple: But, for me and what I’m talking about, it’s kind of like the most efficient way or the best way, the simplest way to do it. And I think it is where you have all the components at hand with one entity.

Judy Bachar: Right.

David Supple: It’s more efficient, right? You can still-

Judy Bachar: It’s power.

David Supple: Yeah, you can get the product lots of different ways.

Judy Bachar: Exactly.

David Supple: But what’s the easiest way? What’s the simplest way? The most efficient, effective way to get that. And this was like, what you just talked about, that’s the thing I realize is you can’t really do it. You could just sit down and write a song for your husband and do it.

Judy Bachar: Right.

David Supple: But, and so in the music industry, ar folks taught that? Is that a known thing? And so… There’s lots of music schools, right?

Judy Bachar: They do.

David Supple: Yeah, cool.

Judy Bachar: They actually do.

David Supple: Cool.

Judy Bachar: They teach you how to write a song, how to compose. They give you great tips, how a song… What makes a song successful.

David Supple: Yeah.

Judy Bachar: If you take ABBA.

David Supple: Yeah.

Judy Bachar: Each and every one of their songs were big, big, huge success.

David Supple: Yeah.

Judy Bachar: Because the music sounds like they actually written it for children.

Judy Bachar: (singing).

Judy Bachar: It’s simple.

David Supple: Yeah.

Judy Bachar: (singing).

Judy Bachar: Or…

Judy Bachar: (singing).

Judy Bachar: It’s for children.

David Supple: Yeah, yeah.

Judy Bachar: And people love it. I’m crazy about ABBA.

David Supple: Yeah.

Judy Bachar: That was a super brilliant combination of great singers and two great composers. The guys wrote the lyrics and the music and the girls sing it. So, it’s easy, it’s like a group that, hey, here is our product.

David Supple: So, it wasn’t one individual.

Judy Bachar: No.

David Supple: But together as a team, they had all the elements needed.

Judy Bachar: Definitely. Yeah, the interactions.

David Supple: So, they could… And I’ve heard of bands and what have you. Maybe…

Judy Bachar: But, that’s one in a million. I’m mean, to find a correct terminal, let’s say great architect and a great builder together.

David Supple: Yeah, and carry them… Yeah, right.

Judy Bachar: And they work really good with no ego inside and know what to do. And if they work together, Oh my God, what they can build, what they can [crosstalk 00:11:38].

David Supple: Right, right, right. Yeah, yeah.

Judy Bachar: Yeah.

David Supple: So, in school, is there a certain years you go to school for music? You went to school for music right?

Judy Bachar: No.

David Supple: No, you didn’t?

Judy Bachar: Actually I haven’t.

David Supple: Oh, okay.

Judy Bachar: I did…. I mean, my learning of music was to listen to it. Because I believe 70 percent of learning music is to listen to it.

David Supple: Yep.

Judy Bachar: Really listened to cello, and the violin doing, what the singer is doing. From classical to opera to pop to jazz, all the great music that I love. I listened to a lot of big voices. And I studied the piano for nine years. So, that definitely learning Mozart and Bach and Beethoven and Chopin and Mendelssohn definitely give you the establishment that you need as a musician.

David Supple: Mm-hmm (affirmative).

Judy Bachar: And then I go… Not long time ago I saw a movie about the Beatles, how they created part of their songs. It was amazing. I mean to see how they think about it. Or I know that there was a film about Queen, how did they become Queen.

David Supple: Were all the Beatles a singer songwriters? Were all those individuals.

Judy Bachar: I think so.

David Supple: Yeah.

Judy Bachar: Take John Lennon, you write (singing). That’s phenomenal. And also Paul McCartney, yes.

David Supple: Yeah.

Judy Bachar: They all were came together like… Queen, they show in the movie how they… So, it was actually the guitar player that understood that they want the reaction from the audience. They want them to be cause. So, how do you make them cause? You make them participate. How? They make the rhythm.

Judy Bachar: (singing).

Judy Bachar: So, everybody’s… They really got nuts.

David Supple: Yeah.

Judy Bachar: And if you think about it, it’s not like, (signing). It’s okay. It’s nice song. It’s not like, I don’t know… But it’s not Puccini opera. It’s complicated, but it’s powerful.

David Supple: Right. I knew that song when I was like five years old.

Judy Bachar: You see? You see?

David Supple: Yeah.

Judy Bachar: So it’s powerful. It’s amazing.

David Supple: Yeah, yeah.

Judy Bachar: I’m big fan of Queen. Yeah.

David Supple: So, but how a musician is taught.

Judy Bachar: Yeah.

David Supple: It’s not separate from performing and you need to play an instrument.

Judy Bachar: Mm-hmm (affirmative).

David Supple: And also write it. Because that’s different than how an architect is trained.

Judy Bachar: Right.

David Supple: Which is significant, I think. Because they never learned to play the instrument.

Judy Bachar: That is weird.

David Supple: I went to school for architecture.

Judy Bachar: Wow.

David Supple: I never built a thing. I had never built a thing in my life until I got out of school. I started practicing, I was an architect. And my job was to direct others on what to build, how to build it. And I was like, “Whoa, hold on, what?” It didn’t make sense to me.

Judy Bachar: Yeah.

David Supple: And-

Judy Bachar: You… yeah. You learn how to design mountains without moving one. So, you just don’t know how to.

David Supple: Right, right. So, I think it is a great analogy to make it real for folks.

Judy Bachar: It is.

David Supple: But somehow, in this industry, in my industry, it’s normal, it’s accepted somehow that that is the way it is.

Judy Bachar: It’s true. It’s true. I actually know… yeah.

David Supple: Yeah. And you learn how to bullshit really good.

Judy Bachar: Yeah.

David Supple: In school.

Judy Bachar: Right.

David Supple: Training to be an architect. That’s part of it. And it becomes complex. It’s not simple.

Judy Bachar: Right.

David Supple: Which is part of it.

Judy Bachar: So, what do you suggest for the people? The architect and the builders right now? What is your-

David Supple: To build. To build.

Judy Bachar: To build.

David Supple: Honestly, to build.

Judy Bachar: Yep. So, you need to go to the school.

David Supple: Learn how to play the instrument.

Judy Bachar: Yeah.

David Supple: And, historically, if you look at history, the derivation of the word architect is master builder. And throughout time that goes back to Greek, ancient Greek age.

Judy Bachar: Right.

David Supple: That’s what the Romans took on the word architect.

Judy Bachar: That’s fascinating.

David Supple: And then, throughout time, you also had the master mason was considered an architect.

Judy Bachar: Yeah.

David Supple: And the word architect actually went away for awhile in the medieval period, the middle ages.

Judy Bachar: Yeah.

David Supple: It was more of the master mason who was the architect. And then in the Renaissance, antiquity was rediscovered and the word architect was came back. But I thought about it when you were talking about this is the best instrument to learn. Because those two words, master mason, master builder, which really is like carpenter. Buildings are made out of wood or masonry.

Judy Bachar: Mm-hmm (affirmative).

David Supple: So, the way you became an architect was you mastered how to build with that tool.

Judy Bachar: Wow. Wow.

David Supple: With that form. And then you were able to step back and direct it and not be the one to design it and direct it. And that makes sense, right?

Judy Bachar: Yes, totally.

David Supple: But you do need to have both. You do need to have the theory and the practical. Because you could have a… And maybe there’s an analogy for this in the music industry, but you could have a contractor who knows how to build and he knows what things cost but he does not have the theory of design and at a higher level of being able to envision, take a client’s concept and create this magnificent… Even though he can do it practically. So, it does take both.

Judy Bachar: Right.

David Supple: And, yeah, what is the analogy for the builder in the music industry? I guess it’s someone who could sing really well or play an instrument, but not necessarily writing. Does that exist? And that exists, right?

Judy Bachar: It does. Well, music is more flexible than building.

David Supple: Yep.

Judy Bachar: Of course. Because you’re using with something like… Well, also with building and architecture, as you’re dealing with the aesthetics. But you also need to take the matter and then create it beautiful, right?

David Supple: Mm-hmm (affirmative). Mm-hmm (affirmative).

Judy Bachar: In music it’s easier because you just (signing). And here it is.

David Supple: Yes.

Judy Bachar: You don’t have to go take the concrete, find a place, you can sing anytime, anywhere. So, it’s actually, you can be a songwriter and singer, like Elton John, like Billy Joel, like the Beatles, like all the… ABBA. All those phenomenal artists that created your own music and singing. And you see when Elton John is singing, his song, or Stevie Wonder, it’s their song. But you also have incredible artists like Barbara Streisand, or Whitney Houston, or Mariah Carey, or you can take Frank Sinatra. He sang other people’s songs. He sang the jazz standards. Okay? There are some songs that were written to him or for him, My Way and stuff like that. But still, he didn’t write any songs and he was highly successful in all times.

Judy Bachar: I think Elvis wrote to his own sings. So, he had the guitar. He wrote most of his songs.

David Supple: Mm-hmm (affirmative).

Judy Bachar: But Sinatra knew he needed that amazing… What was that person he was…

David Supple: There was Ira Gershwin, George Gershwin, Paul [inaudible 00:19:20], all of them.

Judy Bachar: But the folks that would write his music-

Judy Bachar: Jones. He’s… yeah.

David Supple: Quincy Jones. What was he for Sinatra? His choreographer?

Judy Bachar: He created… no. He did the first-

David Supple: He wrote music, right?

Judy Bachar: Yes. But he took a song, I don’t know which one, I just saw it recently. But he’s a ranger of songs.

David Supple: A ranger.

Judy Bachar: He’s a ranger. He can take a song that sounds okay and make it like 1 million dollar song.

David Supple: Okay.

Judy Bachar: 100 million dollar song.

David Supple: Okay.

Judy Bachar: That’s his… because this guy, [inaudible 00:19:51]. He went to school, university. He knows.

David Supple: Yeah.

Judy Bachar: He knows his way, so.

David Supple: But I’m just thinking, Sinatra, even though that wasn’t… He didn’t have that skill, let’s say, or that ability.

Judy Bachar: Yep.

David Supple: He knew all the components that were needed.

Judy Bachar: Right.

David Supple: And he would assemble that team. And to create that product, right?

Judy Bachar: It’s like when my grandmother used to make a cake. I definitely delivered ingredients, but definitely she could make it go right.

David Supple: Yeah.

Judy Bachar: You know what I mean? It’s like… That’s the magic. So, that’s why music, if you’re find the right terminal and then you have a great show, voice, talent, and then you find someone who writes the correct song for you, boom, it’s a killer. And in an other way, you write your own music, and, boom, it’s amazing. So, either way you can succeed.

David Supple: Yeah.

Judy Bachar: So you have this possibility. But I think a combination of being an architect but doesn’t know nothing about building. It’s a little bit weird.

David Supple: Yeah, it’s problematic.

Judy Bachar: Yeah, it is.

David Supple: And the industry suffers from it in terms of reputation and defects and…

Judy Bachar: Also costs. Because if you’re one, you get two in one.

David Supple: Yeah.

Judy Bachar: It’s easier.

David Supple: We have a law… My firm, it’s very common for folks to call us up and have gone through a design experience with an architect and have the costs be two or three times what they were looking to spend. So, they have plans that they love better, and they could hang them on their wall as art.

Judy Bachar: Wow.

David Supple: But it’s not that… What you said is it’s simpler in music because it is just in art.

Judy Bachar: Right.

David Supple: Not just an art, but… But, in architecture it is an art for sure, but where folks go wrong sometimes it’s just calling it’s an art. It’s an art. No, it’s an art and it’s an actual physical thing.

Judy Bachar: Right.

David Supple: Folks are going to live in use and there’s more to it than just that.

Judy Bachar: Exactly.

David Supple: So, when you call architecture art, it’s not not true, but it’s misleading because it doesn’t end there.

Judy Bachar: Totally, because it’s only on the paper, and now you have to take this and see that it really comes out in physical universe.

David Supple: Yep. Exactly.

Judy Bachar: Totally, Oh my God. It’s actually very inspiring and it’s amazing.

David Supple: And the majority of history the architect built. And that’s the thing that this is the design build movement [inaudible 00:22:36]. I don’t… I usually do an intro so now I’m going to have good write it up.

Judy Bachar: Yeah.

David Supple: But this is Judy Bachar. I first met Judy, she sang at our child’s christening, our naming ceremony. And she is amazing. As you…

Judy Bachar: Thank you, Dave. Thank you.

David Supple: You were just able to experience. And I want to have this analogy to make it real for folks because the purpose of the design build movement is to educate folks on my industry and how it doesn’t really make sense how things are set up. And once folks are educated, they can look for what they really need. Because folks hire an architect or a builder, it’s not just one that’s right or wrong. You need to have it all. And if you think you’re getting everything by hiring one, you may, but you may not. So, folks need to be educated on the various components so that they are. And I love the fact that this analogy, I think, it makes it real for people.

Judy Bachar: Right. It does.

David Supple: Of how it doesn’t really make sense the way it is now. It’s like having a singer songwriter and then breaking it down to a person who sings, performs the , and somebody who writes it, and then breaking it down. In terms of the folks who perform it, let’s say, where you have a guitar player or drummer… There’s lots of people that go into this and you can have it one entity at the top or you can have it as a group of people. But today, that derivation of the word architect, it’s like bringing it down here as just a designer. Not to say just a designer, but it is just one component that it used to be, where that person was fully accountable and able to achieve the product solely. And it’s calling it… It’s confused.

Judy Bachar: Yes.

David Supple: It’s like the definition has changed but folks haven’t caught up to…

Judy Bachar: I see. But it’s amazing that you can actually bring it up and tell them, hey, folks, actually an architect it’s a master builder.

David Supple: Exactly.

Judy Bachar: He’s the guy who builds. So, and it makes sense. Because if you want to build something, you have to know how to do it. So, I know there are engineers and there are builders and all kinds of stuff, right?

David Supple: Mm-hmm (affirmative).

Judy Bachar: But, I think it’s, you have to know. For sure.

David Supple: For sure.

Judy Bachar: If you want to be a great singer, you should probably know how to [inaudible 00:25:35] one instrument at least.

David Supple: Mm-hmm (affirmative).

Judy Bachar: So, you have a good hearing, so you can accompany yourself, mostly on the piano. That’s what most singers learn.

David Supple: Mm-hmm (affirmative).

Judy Bachar: And it gives you confidence if you just want to go on a piano. Take Lady Gaga, she writes her own song, she go on a piano, and here you are. It’s very… It’s also when people see a singer that plays, something is happening there. It’s like, “Oh wow. He plays an instrument.”

David Supple: Mm-hmm (affirmative).

Judy Bachar: So, he’s educational. It’s not like he have a great voice and he started to sing and, okay, his luck. But, oh, you really devoted time and went to school and been educated. People give a lot of time for education. So, if they ask me, “How did you educate yourself with music.” And I tell them, “Yeah, I learned the piano for nine years. I’ve been here, I’ve been that, I listened to a lot of music, I educated myself in any way I could.” And it’s important. It’s important for the singer.

David Supple: Mm-hmm (affirmative).

Judy Bachar: It’s important for musician, for the art, and for people. Definitely.

David Supple: When you sing, I get tingles at lot. Yeah, I said that. Chills.

Judy Bachar: He’s a friend.

David Supple: Yeah. I think other people do too.

Judy Bachar: Thank you.

David Supple: It’s amazing.

Judy Bachar: Yeah, it’s my honor and I love it. So, yes.

David Supple: I’m playing with these analogies because I think it’s a good way for folks to understand it. And when architects got separated from the build, the guys who did it were all builders.

Judy Bachar: Mm (affirmative).

David Supple: It was really a social status play. In the mid-1800’s after the civil war is where it real split. And it was a time of economic boom. These guys all knew how to build, but they wanted to get the best builders.

Judy Bachar: Okay.

David Supple: And so they wanted to say, “Hey.” And they created a group called the American Institute of Architects and said, “Hey, only we can call ourselves architects now.”

Judy Bachar: Wow.

David Supple: And they did that so that they could get these best projects and be distinguished and differentiated because anybody can call themselves an architect.

Judy Bachar: Right.

David Supple: But they knew how to build. So, it was okay.

Judy Bachar: Fascinating. Wow.

David Supple: And they could get products, so they could just do the design. But they were setting up the project for success because they knew. But then it got into universities. That’s where it really got messed up.

Judy Bachar: Yeah.

David Supple: Because the universities were like, “Building, oh, uh-uh (negative).”

Judy Bachar: No. Yeah.

David Supple: And so then you had a few cycles of that and you get today where a guy like me comes out of school and is like, “What am I doing?”

Judy Bachar: Wow. Now, I was also thinking about fashion design.

David Supple: That’s a good… yeah.

Judy Bachar: You can do the design, but you don’t know how to do the stuff.

David Supple: Right.

Judy Bachar: How do you know.

David Supple: So, imagine if fashion design or music, I don’t know if we can do it with that too, but got so busy that… And there was more recognition in the design part of it where this group got together, say fashion designers got together and they were like, “Hey, we’re just going to design it. We’re going to create a name exclusive to us. And we’re going to just do that.”

Judy Bachar: Yeah.

David Supple: Even though these guys actually did direct the build, it was really later where it got spoiled, separated, because they just stopped being able to do it and be responsible and accountable for it. But just this analogy of another industry, that happening, I don’t think it could ever happen. It just wouldn’t make sense. It would be so apparent.

Judy Bachar: Right, right. I mean, I think, let’s take the movie, the industry. So, you have the director, you would have the the actress. I mean I don’t think the director needs to be the actress, but there are some actresses that that are directors.

David Supple: Mm-hmm (affirmative), mm-hmm (affirmative), mm-hmm (affirmative).

Judy Bachar: But it’s okay if you have they’re very professional director who direct you because he sees things that you don’t see from there and the actress is actually living the thing and he’s living the way he thinks he should be. So, these terminals working together. That’s okay. But in building and being an architect, I think, yeah, they separated. I think. I don’t understand why because it actually it has to be one. Okay, I design it because I know how to built it. And, of course, you don’t have to do it yourself, but you know what to do. And then you call and the people… And you can work with them or not, but you’re still there, you know when you were doing.

David Supple: Yep.

Judy Bachar: Its not like, okay, here are the things, you go and do it. So, between the architect and the builder, it can be a huge gap because he doesn’t understand what he’s talking about.

David Supple: Mm-hmm (affirmative).

Judy Bachar: And, so, it can get confusion, and to get to extra hours and working and that and doing the wrong thing, and then the client is not happy, et cetera, et cetera.

David Supple: Yeah. There’s a disconnect there, which there often is. Because it’s an adversity [inaudible 00:00:30:59], it’s set up to be adversarial.

Judy Bachar: Right.

David Supple: And so it is a problem. We’re bringing it back to the way it’s supposed to be. Yes, yes.

Judy Bachar: Yes. Go, Dave, go, Dave. I’m happy about it. It’s actually keep me thinking about it and I like [inaudible 00:00:31:16]. It’s just the awareness level of how we look at things.

David Supple: Yeah, yeah.

Judy Bachar: Yeah, I love it.

David Supple: Yeah, I mean, in the movie industry, in music, cooking, fashion design, there needs to be someone responsible. There needs to be someone, whether it’s Frank Sinatra…

Judy Bachar: Yes was responsible.

David Supple: Who’s not doing it, like he’s not actually physically. But he is still orchestra. He know.

Judy Bachar: He knows.

David Supple: Everything. I just went to Europe for the first time.

Judy Bachar: He’s not a puppet. He knows, yeah, he feels and say, you can give me more orchestra, give him more trumpet here, or give more more.. He does that just because he feels it. He’s the one who execute the [inaudible 00:32:01].

David Supple: Yeah.

Judy Bachar: Yeah.

David Supple: He’s accountable. He’s responsible.

Judy Bachar: Yeah, exactly.

David Supple: And in my industry there needs to be somebody accountable, somebody responsible.

Judy Bachar: Right, right. Oh my God.

David Supple: Otherwise the client is left in between.

Judy Bachar: Right.

David Supple: And they are not qualified.

Judy Bachar: That’s a huge thing.

David Supple: So, that’s the main thing that I’m trying to achieve, and bring people’s awareness up so that occurs, yeah. In Europe, I found, I just went to Europe. The States is really where it got me. They messed everything up and then brought it to the world.

Judy Bachar: I see.

David Supple: I feel in Europe, it is more known what the components are, even though it might be separated, it’s understood that there needs to be that collaboration in that team to get the product.

Judy Bachar: Wow. Yeah. They are more in the are and the… Look at Europe, it’s beautiful. And here is, yeah. There are beautiful sides.

David Supple: Yeah.

Judy Bachar: Less beautiful sides.

David Supple: Well, also there’s all those examples of buildings that were done through this. So, I think that’s part of it.

Judy Bachar: Yeah.

David Supple: And we just haven’t infiltrated as much from the States to really mess them up as much as we are. But, thank you so much.

Judy Bachar: You’re welcome.

David Supple: We’re going to head off.

Judy Bachar: Thank you.

David Supple: Thank you.

Judy Bachar: Thank you for inviting to the beautiful interview.

David Supple: Yeah, yeah.